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Forum - Ghosts as "Energy" and the Dead Communicating with the Living?

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WvethPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 22:25
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I just want to hear some thoughts on this, get a little discussion going.

My friend and her mother are firm believers in the whole "ghosts as energy" deal; meaning, they can sense past lives or "ghosts" or whatever, especially in connection to objects. She told me a story about a bracelet, I think it was. How nobody in the house was sleeping well when this bracelet was there, and apparently a bunch of them had the same dream about a young girl.

Then, I'm told, my friend's mother came in, and sensed this "young girl" and ended up figuring out where the bracelet originated from. My friend's friend said he got it from a Mom & Pop trinket store in Toronto, and apparently they had a daughter who died or something.

Now, I know this is the vaguest shit you could read, and in my opinion, I can only say, I wasn't there, I didn't see how the situation unfolded, but I imagine it was mostly self-delusion and wanting to believe things, throwing explanations where none are due.

But what do y'all think?

tl;dr - can ghosts attach themselves to objects as "energy" to be felt by the living?

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Edward L WinstonPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:00
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Well, energy in the New Age sense is nothing like it is in the scientific sense. Real energy attaches itself to everything (c/p) in the form of kinetic, potential, thermal, gravitational, sound, elastic, light, and/or electromagnetic.

None of those on that list will cause dreams, though too much gravity will cause you to black out, sometimes seeing visions.

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SkyPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:12
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Ghosts don't exist, that's all I have to say about that.

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sorryPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:13
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Maybe not, but the movie Ghost was one of the best ever.

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Edward L WinstonPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:15
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President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho: porn star and five-time ultimate smackdown wrestling champion!

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Patrick Swayze and I often break out my pottery wheel and go to town.

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WvethPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:15
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So gravity is to blame, eh? Hmm.

Actually, I went with my friend on a job she was doing (she is a tattoo artist) at someone's home. She brought her mother along.

Anyway, the lady she was tattooing was also into that stuff. She was known as a bit of a kook around town, but she's a very nice, pleasant lady.

She mentioned how her dog would never go into the basement, and how she herself didn't like being down there. Inevitably, her and my friend's mother got talking. When two people like that meet, they just won't stop. One of them said it was an older fellow. She pictured an old-timey pilgrim hat. The tattooee agreed.

It went on like that. "I sense this and this and this." "Yeah, I sense that too, and also this and this and this." "Me too!"

Since they were ALL firm believers, I knew I had to shut my trap and stop from shouting "YOU'RE JUST AGREEING WITH EACH OTHER NO MATTER WHAT."

Argh.

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sorryPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:17
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I try to avoid that type.

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WvethPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:20
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I CAN'T. That friend is my best friend and I absolutely love her. I do talk about it with them, individually. But as a group it's just being gang-raped by GHOST ENERGY. Or is that their own need for self-delusion?

I always get those two mixed up.

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anticultistPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:21
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Try researching gods helmet and the effects of electromagnetism on the brain.

Theres a starting point for you.

http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&source=hp&q=gods+helmet&aq=f&aqi=g1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=c151cbec9886e72

Chances are its delusional but if you want to attribute it to anything the nearest possible explanation might be something like the above.

#9 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
WvethPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:22
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I really like the term "God's helmet." It's like what I wish I had when I first took my training wheels off.

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sorryPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:25
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Yeah, it sounds cool.

#11 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
WvethPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:29
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I also know a lot of people who have had religious visions and things like that. I get stared at when I say it's pretty much a nice-feeling version of mass hysteria.

I've heard of weird things happening with people who live under power lines. Is this "God's helmet" thing the same idea? That differing electromagneticism in the air causes minor brain disruption?

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anticultistPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:32
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Brainwashing you for money

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Yes Wveth, messing with the brains normal functions, and making them go ape.

#13 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
NanosPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:35
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Perhaps I should start with what I think ghosts could be, that is telephathic communication from people alive about dead people.

Now I'll explain my logic..

> Ghosts don't exist, that's all I have to say about that.

I have seen one, once that I'm aware of.

My parents had some elderly folk come to visit us once to buy some antique chairs, they sat in the lounge and I was summoned to offer them tea and biscuits. So I went into the lounge and went around the group, asking each in turn if they wanted tea or coffee, sugar and/or milk, and what biscuits might take their fancy.

I reported back to the kitchen with my mum there, who wanted what, and remarked that one of the group refused to answer me, and just sat there staring into space, I mentioned the guy seemed a little odd, as he sat in the sofa legless, and whilst I knew he didn't have legs, I couldn't clearly remember below his waist, even though it was just a few minutes ago, but only that he did not have any.

Anyhow, I took the tea and biscuits in, an noticed the guy was missing, so I asked 'Where is the old guy without any legs ?', and much to their shock, they remarked that they had come alone that day!

They mentioned that a relative had recently died, one who fitted the description of the guy, including without both legs..

Now, what had I seen ?

I'm reminded of another incident, not ghost related..

I was building myself a very large ameatur radio aerial, a full wave circular antenna, and at the time I was standing inside of it, I had a sudden urge to ring my then girlfriend. (I never got sudden urges like that!) I duly did so, and she remarked that she had just been wishing I was there, as her son had just swallowed a key and she thought I would be able to help her situation, except she couldn't ring me! (Her phone had incoming calls only..)

So...

Had I picked up telephathic communication from her ?

Had the aerial acted as some kind of booster device to enable that to more easily happen ?

Have I had other communication experiences with people..

Well yes, from time to time, I have suprised folk with being able to read their minds. (I remember one time playing charades I kept guessing before the person even spoke what was in their mind!)

I wonder if hair length might have anything to do with it, acting perhaps as an aerial.. (As my best period of being able to do so, was when I had long hair also.)

So you can see my logic, and my thought that whilst we see ghosts, they might be just communication chatter we pick up from other people thinking about them. (This might explain why we don't see tons of ghosts everywhere in cities, where countless folk have died in the same place hundreds if not thousands of times, but there is no one alive today who remembers them..)

So, whilst I might reckon that something exists, I think its possible its just communication and nothing physically real, nor anything that can harm us. (Unless perhaps we think it can..)

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Agent MattPosted: Jun 27, 2010 - 23:44
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Ghosts are dumb.

When you die, you're worm food and nothing more.

#15 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
NanosPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 00:51
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> When you die, you're worm food and nothing more.

Agreed.

But there still appears to be a phenomenon that needs explaining how it works..

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Agent MattPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 11:13
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"But there still appears to be a phenomenon that needs explaining how it works.. "

No there isn't.

#17 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
NanosPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 11:50
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> No there isn't.

Then how do you explain eye witness accounts of something unusual such as mine ?

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anticultistPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 11:56
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Its not up to us to explain it Nanos since its not us who is claiming to have the experience. It is up to you to come up with a rational and scientific answer, or have your claims rebuked by people who think your explanation may be weak.

So the question should be what do you think it was and how can you explain it ?

#19 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
NanosPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 12:16
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I suggested that instead of it being dead people communicating, that it was alive people transmitting thoughts to people around them about dead people they knew of.

Which then moves the goal posts a bit towards, can we prove telepathic communication..

http://www.urigeller.com/nyt.htm</p>

> Scientists at the Stanford research Institute who conducted experiments with a
> number of persons, including Uri Geller, the magician and purported psychic,
> report that Mr. Geller, and probably most people. have an ability to send and
> receive information by some "as yet unidentified perceptual modality."

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v251/n5476/abs/251602a0.html

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NanosPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 12:17
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> Its not up to us to explain it

Actually its up to all of us, including you!

Its not up to the people reporting events to explain it, though it would be helpful if they can of course.

#21 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
anticultistPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 12:21
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Well its impossible for someone to explain an experiential account when they were not there and the only evidence is personal witness testimony. So you see it is upto you to explain what else may be an explanation you may of overlooked, for instance in a qualia soup video here see the ghost part @50 seconds and how it explains the obvious possible explanation that is being overlooked. Without these facts the story takes on a new meaning

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

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EdPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 12:23
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Nanos,

You did NOT just promote Uri Geller did you?

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Agent MattPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 12:48
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"Then how do you explain eye witness accounts of something unusual such as mine ? "

You need medication.

#24 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
Sil the ShillPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:39
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I had heard someone else mention that Uri Geller proving his ESP in a lab. I believe him to be nothing more than a charlatan, but is there a debunking for that experiment around somewhere?

#25 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
EdPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:44
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Just search google for it with James Randi's name, if there is a response Randi has already done so years ago.

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sorryPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:45
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There's a reason why I love Johnny Carson.

#27 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
Agent MattPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:53
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Uh, Geller was debunked in the 80s man.

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Sil the ShillPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:55
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The first two results for "uri geller stanford experiment debunked randi" were WWu77's site. :|

"Uh, Geller was debunked in the 80s man. "

Yeah, I know there's plenty of other examples of him being a total sham, and like I said I don't believe for a second that he's legit. I just wanted to find out more information about this experiment, and how they arrived at their (what I believe to be) flawed conclusions.

#29 [ Top | Reply to Topic ]
anticultistPosted: Jun 28, 2010 - 13:57
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Hes a zeitgeister isnt he ?

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